Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

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TomO
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by TomO »

Proud new owners of a 2020 DA40-180 with the Garmin NXi G1000 system. Previous Diamond was a 2005. The NXi is a huge improvement. But the blue tooth connection to ForeFlight is much worse than the old plane. Both use the 345R transponder. Today I looked under the floor of the baggage compartment and found it to be totally different from our early version and from the photos posted on this forum. This 2020 model also has the same landing gear as the diesel NG. I have been told Diamond is working on a gross weight certification increase, but if it takes as long as the Canadian Type Certification of this new NXi model, I may be waiting for years.

I have no idea where the Transponder is under all this aluminum, but I can assume that the blue tooth output hole is covered with more than just a GARMIN sticker. Does anyone recognize this setup and have any suggestions for improved reception?
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AlSimmons
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by AlSimmons »

I was using TomO iPad and didn’t log out. I have reposted to the forum using my account. Please reply to AlSimmons. Sorry, I’m new to this forum. Thanks.
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pietromarx
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by pietromarx »

I'd be very curious as to what you see as the differences between the 2005 and 2020 models.

On the Bluetooth side there is very likely little that you can do beyond what's described in this thread. Having worked on Bluetooth in a previous job, I can safely say that it was never intended for this application. Poor old Harald (you'll catch the meaning if you're techie enough) only meant for his standard to cross from one's hip pocket to, at most, the other side of one's upper body and that assumed you had no metal implants.
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AlSimmons
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by AlSimmons »

I appreciate the question about the differences between our older 2005 DA40 and the all new 2020 model. There are so many that I will post a new title thread. It may take me a few days to edit down the information so it is not as long as a novel.

Regarding Bluetooth signal, I thought that if I found the avionics installation matched the 2005 and the other pictures posted on this thread, that I would simply put a small hole through the carbon floor panel in line with the hole in the transponder. The carpet would remain untouched. This should allow the directed signal to blast out into the cockpit area. Maybe better than trying to pick it up with a small antenna over the hole in the transponder and hoping the power runs through a coax and out another antenna. Both of those antennas would work better if they were attached to a metal ground plane. But I won't be able to try this idea on our new Diamond. Maybe another owner will give it a shot. Save the the removed disk of carbon in case an IA someday wants the hole filled back in. But it would not need to be larger than the hole in the compartment made for the rubber grommet that the coax goes through, and I see an IA approved that idea for a member.
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yl472401
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by yl472401 »

With the mini-wipe antenna, how would you place it against the G345R surface, same as the micro-chip antenna?
Could you send a picture with the mini-wipe antenna installed?
Thanks.
Ultrapilot1 wrote: Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:24 pm
Chris B wrote: Wed Mar 06, 2019 3:24 am It turns out that the tiny U.FL connectors need to be well-supported. IME, the U.FL <-> RP-SMA adapter connection is easy to accidentally disconnect. :oops:

After consulting with my RF guru friend, the new plan is to substitute a mini-whip antenna in place of the microstrip antenna. This requires using an SMA to RP-SMA adapter instead of the U.FL/RP-SMA adapter, but the connections are now all robust. My friend expects no material performance difference. The gap from the top of the GTX345R to the carbon fiber cover is ~10mm (3/8"), which provides plenty of room for the small whip antenna.

Since others may be implementing this solution, I wanted to update this thread even though I have not yet received or installed the new components:
My IA has also OK'd drilling the small access hole in the bulkhead for routing, lined with a rubber grommet. More pics after installation, but this could be a few weeks.

Chris
Awesome! I already implemented the new version with the micro antenna and it works like a charm! Thank you for solving a really annoying problem!
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Chris B
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by Chris B »

yl472401 wrote: Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:30 pm With the mini-wipe antenna, how would you place it against the G345R surface, same as the micro-chip antenna?
Could you send a picture with the mini-wipe antenna installed?
Thanks.
For mounting the mini-whip antenna, see the post on page 2:
viewtopic.php?p=74186#p74186

BTW, the black "hole" on the blue GTX345 label is actually just a Sharpie mark for positioning. The label is intact.

Chris
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by CFIDave »

TomO wrote: Sun Dec 27, 2020 2:03 am Proud new owners of a 2020 DA40-180 with the Garmin NXi G1000 system.
Congrats on your new plane!
Your photo shows that Lycoming DA40s now ship with a metal HIRF box surrounding the G1000 equipment rack that's located under the rear baggage compartment.

Diamond has been installing HIRF boxes for Legacy G1000 DA42s and DA40NGs for many years, but this is the first I've seen it used for Lycoming DA40s, most likely because it's now required for NXi that just started shipping on Lycoming DA40s this year (2020).

A HIRF box is designed to shield all of the G1000 LRUs (including the GTX345R) located within, and makes Bluetooth reception outside of the box much more difficult. (I can just barely and intermittently pick up GTX345R Bluetooth from the cockpit of my DA62 that has a HIRF box located in the fuselage nose avionics bay.)

With G1000 NXi, the preferred solution to Bluetooth reception is to install a FlightStream 510 wireless SDCard. It will permit your iPad/iPhone running Foreflight or Garmin Pilot to receive all of the same information you'd get directly from a GTX345R, but also let you synchronize flight plans. That's what I've installed in my NXi DA62, now equipped with NXi Phase II hardware/software similar to what's in your new NXi DA40.
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by smoss »

Dave, how do you get that HIRF box off to access the LRUs? It looks like you'd have to take out the whole back shell just to access something in there.
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by smoss »

Tom, you mentioned it does not have the gross weight certification increase. Are you saying it does not come standard with the 2646 max, or are you talking about and increase even beyond that? Thanks.
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Re: Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics

Post by CFIDave »

smoss wrote: Tue Dec 29, 2020 3:32 pm Dave, how do you get that HIRF box off to access the LRUs? It looks like you'd have to take out the whole back shell just to access something in there.
It takes more work, but you can remove the metal top off of the HIRF box (held on by screws) to get to the G1000 equipment rack located inside.

Shown here is the inside of the HIRF box of my Legacy G1000 DA42-VI back in 2015 when we replaced the GTX33 transponder with a GTX33ES to get ADS-B Out (this was right before Garmin introduced the GTX345R transponder). The empty space at the front of the G1000 equipment rack is where we temporarily removed the transponder. A DA40 installation under the HIRF box cover should look about the same.
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