Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

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TwinStarScott
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by TwinStarScott »

Very interesting Rich - thanks for the close-up view! So you've mounted the claw on the grip itself, which must also make for a nice hand rest. Will have to visit that option again when time allows. Awhile back, I may have thought about that same mounting location, only just below the grip - but was concerned it might crush an exposed wire running up the control stick.

Yes, angled cables are great for use in the cockpit and the best source I've found for these is Amazon (for better or worse).

Monoprice.com can be a another good source for inexpensive USB cables, just not angled ones:
https://www.monoprice.com/search/ihttps ... usb+cables+

For a "reasonably" priced over-the-ear, bluetooth capable headset - check out Lightspeed:

https://www.lightspeedaviation.com/

Indeed "It never ends" . . . .
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TomJ
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by TomJ »

I did my GTX345 upgrade last week (this post: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6746&start=42)). My installation also included wiring for a Flightstream 110 under the passenger seat - the avionics shop didn't receive my FS110 in time so they tested the installation with another FS110 unit and left the wiring capped in place.

Traffic capability seemed to work well on a flight from San Jose to Paso Robles and back today, on the MFD and on Foreflight connected to the GTX345R via Bluetooth (no passengers or luggage). It definitely helps you to spot traffic that ATC called out, especially after some time has passed since they've pointed it out and it's now at a different place than when they first called it out. Even if you never see it, it's easy to figure out which target they've pointed out and you can then make sure you keep a safe distance from it.

I'll update after the FS110 installation.
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by TwinStarScott »

Thanks for the update Tom. Your DA40 has now become the perfect test bed for recording before and after results. Even more so because you can actually fly your airplane. Whereas with my installation, all the BT testing was done entirely inside a hangar.

Therefore, I have a few questions for you:

1) are you currently able to receive any AHRS data on your iPad?

2) or has your FS110 wiring (capped off) knocked the 345R AHRS data offline?

If you have these items handy, please try loading up:

1. a canopy cover in the baggage compartment, stored in a duffel bag

2. a good size suitcase in the rear seat.

In my case, the addition of 1 and a cold Wx survival bag weighing around 45lbs. - made the 345R BT signal become intermittent (best case).

If at all possible, please retest with the above similar items to see if traffic and ADS-B Wx consistently work on your iPad. And if available, the AHRS data too.
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by TomJ »

Okay, Scott - today I carried out the tests you suggested.

> 1) are you currently able to receive any AHRS data on your iPad?
> 2) or has your FS110 wiring (capped off) knocked the 345R AHRS data offline?

Yes, able to receive, so apparently the wiring itself has not disabled the GTX345R data

> If you have these items handy, please try loading up:
>1. a canopy cover in the baggage compartment, stored in a duffel bag
>2. a good size suitcase in the rear seat.

Loaded it with a good sized suitcase in the back seat + 1 rear seat passenger, and also two rear seat passengers and no suitcase. The standard Bruce canopy cover, duffel bag and engine cover were in the baggage area.

I was able to receive ADS-B and AHRS data on the iPad under these conditions, but there was a yellow "Connext, Marginal" indication on the upper left corner of the Foreflight map.

Perhaps with some other (e.g. more conductive) baggage I might not have been able to receive information via bluetooth from the 345R. I'm going to retain my current configuration for a while longer, but I think I'll eventually add the FS110 for reliable bluetooth connectivity since I'm not placing much value on the AHRS data from the 345R to the iPad.

On a slightly digressive topic, I did my required ADS-B rebate program rules flight yesterday: KRHV in San Jose, CA to KPAO (about 15nm inside the KSFO mode C veil), did two landings at KPAO and flew back. Apparently that flight failed the 30 min requirement by 19 secs :x !
The flight was recorded on system as about 48 min, but I'm guessing the time taxiing at Palo Alto wasn't counted.

However I got a letter from the rebate program office saying that I didn't need to re-fly; someone will review my situation and tell me within three business days if I can continue as is.

So those of you who haven't done your rebate flight yet - plan a little buffer!

-Tom
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by Rich »

I've heard several cases of the FAA exhibiting laudable flexibility with marginal failures of ADS-B rebate qualification flights. :thumbsup:
2002 DA40: MT, PF, 530W/430W, KAP140, ext. baggage, 1090 ES out, 2646 MTOW, 40gal., Surefly, Flightstream 210.
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by yl472401 »

TomJ wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:20 am
I did my GTX345 upgrade last week (this post: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6746&start=42)). My installation also included wiring for a Flightstream 110 under the passenger seat - the avionics shop didn't receive my FS110 in time so they tested the installation with another FS110 unit and left the wiring capped in place.

Traffic capability seemed to work well on a flight from San Jose to Paso Robles and back today, on the MFD and on Foreflight connected to the GTX345R via Bluetooth (no passengers or luggage). It definitely helps you to spot traffic that ATC called out, especially after some time has passed since they've pointed it out and it's now at a different place than when they first called it out. Even if you never see it, it's easy to figure out which target they've pointed out and you can then make sure you keep a safe distance from it.

I'll update after the FS110 installation.
Does GTX345R installation always comes with FS access wiring? Does that mean, there's a chance that GTX345R is compatible with GS110 or 210?
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by Rich »

TomJ wrote:
Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:14 am
I was able to receive ADS-B and AHRS data on the iPad under these conditions, but there was a yellow "Connext, Marginal" indication on the upper left corner of the Foreflight map.
-Tom
This is a normal message. The "marginal" doesn't reflect communication problems between the iPad and the Flight Stream. It simply means there is only one ADS-B ground station available.
2002 DA40: MT, PF, 530W/430W, KAP140, ext. baggage, 1090 ES out, 2646 MTOW, 40gal., Surefly, Flightstream 210.
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by TwinStarScott »

Regarding your second question Bryan:

As discussed in a previous thread on this forum, the FS210 is compatible with the GTX345R. As I’ve had this combination since the winter of 2016 and most likely I am not the only legacy G1000 / Diamond owner who is flying with this setup. Though this may require some FSDO shopping to add a FS210 into the mix. Yet this is possible from both a technical and approval standpoint.

The major take away for any Diamond owner who has yet to upgrade to a GTX-345R is to have your avionics shop test the Bluetooth signal before they button up the aircraft completely (re-installing the front and rear seats, etc.). This test ideally should be performed during the installation by only sliding into place the baggage compartment floor and shell to determine the BT signal strength in the cockpit of your specific airframe.

Then have a plan already in place if the BT reception is weak or unreliable. As the BT reception varies greatly in legacy aircraft - so please be sure to discuss options with your avionics shop well ahead of the installation about the possibility of installing a FS210. I also remember my avionics shop highly recommending the FS210 over the FS110, so as to receive AHRS data in Garmin Pilot (this was before the Garmin / ForeFlight agreement).

On this subject, there is another related thread on DAN, where a low cost, uncertified extended antenna project has been described in fine detail by a creative DA40 owner (Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics).

If you, or others, have further questions on the FS210 / GTX345R hardware combination, please feel free to send me a PM.
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by Kyle »

TwinStarScott wrote:
Fri Sep 04, 2020 6:51 am
Regarding your second question Bryan:

As discussed in a previous thread on this forum, the FS210 is compatible with the GTX345R. As I’ve had this combination since the winter of 2016 and most likely I am not the only legacy G1000 / Diamond owner who is flying with this setup. Though this may require some FSDO shopping to add a FS210 into the mix. Yet this is possible from both a technical and approval standpoint.

The major take away for any Diamond owner who has yet to upgrade to a GTX-345R is to have your avionics shop test the Bluetooth signal before they button up the aircraft completely (re-installing the front and rear seats, etc.). This test ideally should be performed during the installation by only sliding into place the baggage compartment floor and shell to determine the BT signal strength in the cockpit of your specific airframe.

Then have a plan already in place if the BT reception is weak or unreliable. As the BT reception varies greatly in legacy aircraft - so please be sure to discuss options with your avionics shop well ahead of the installation about the possibility of installing a FS210. I also remember my avionics shop highly recommending the FS210 over the FS110, so as to receive AHRS data in Garmin Pilot (this was before the Garmin / ForeFlight agreement).

On this subject, there is another related thread on DAN, where a low cost, uncertified extended antenna project has been described in fine detail by a creative DA40 owner (Inexpensive DIY solution to GTX345R Bluetooth problem - with pics).

If you, or others, have further questions on the FS210 / GTX345R hardware combination, please feel free to send me a PM.
Scott,
Does flight plan transfer work with your setup or do you use the FS210 just to get a usable Bluetooth signal?
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Re: Path to ADS-B & WAAS for older DA40s

Post by TwinStarScott »

Good question Kyle.

It was only the latter because with a non-WAAS TDI DA42, we are limited to GDU version 9.05.

However, with GDU version 11.12 (and higher) they “added flight plan import/export” capability back in March of 2011. What is interesting about your question is this software feature was released slightly over three years before the announcement of the FlightStream products (110/210) - and a standalone GTX-345R does not support this cool feature.

Which leads to another question for all DAN members:

Are there any legacy G1000 owners out there who happen to be running GDU version 12.03 with the combination of a FS210 and a GTX-345R? If so, please let the rest of us know if this import/export feature works as advertised. Thanks!

As it sure would be nice to save all that knob twisting on the old MFD, plus allow for the management of flight plans to entirely take place on an iPad (using either ForeFlight or Garmin Pilot). As well as being able to handle ATC reroutes by the sole* means of an iPad. With once again, no knob twisting required – especially handy when time is of the essence.

However, I can remember a while back at least one DAN member writing they did not care much for this feature. Maybe some of the NXi / FS510 owners would be willing to share some of their opinions about the flight plan transfer feature.

*other than pressing the enter key on the MFD (PFD too?) to accept the new flight plan.
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