Garmin 345R ADS-B installation

[Steven]

I've been following the ADSB saga for some time. My plan was to hold out until the easy, elegant, inexpensive solution became available. I'm still holding my breath.

I have a 2007 DA40 XL with no WAAS. I have XM Weather and TAS 600. I'd like to keep both of those, and have ADSB IN and OUT with no iPads, Stratus, Foreflight, or other extraneous junk required. As far as I can tell, there is still no solution for that configuration. Maybe the mythical "software upgrade" will be the answer? I'm not sure what this software upgrade is supposed to do, actually.

[Ultrapilot1]

The "mythical" software update would allow us to see ADS-B weather on our G1000 (non-waas owners). Right now as you most likely already know, the only way we can see weather on the G1000 is to have and pay for Sirius XM and install the associated adapter. I understand that you want to wait hoping for an in-expensive solution but you also need to be aware that as we get closer to the deadline the installers get busier. I had to wait 6 weeks to get in and my dealer said the lead time for installs has been getting steadily longer as more people come to the same realization. It won't be a problem for those who are not based or flying in or out of towered airports but for the rest of us it's an issue. I had a backup GPS (Aera 660) and that was providing weather but still preferred to see it on my G1000 so I bit the bullet and installed a GDL69 (XM adaptor) and along with my GTX335R I have weather and traffic on my G1000. I can still see weather and traffic on my Aera 660 via Bluetooth so I have some redundancy. I actually like the XM weather over the ADS-B weather. I can get it on the ground and the picture is smooth not, blocky.

[Steven]

It's good to know there is an example of a non-WAAS G1000 with XM weather installation of a GTX335R that worked. Has anyone successfully got a TAS600 to work also after the GTX335R installation on a non-WAAS G1000? I know there is a debate over which is better, TAS600 vs ADSB traffic, but I'd like to ignore that for now.

[Barry]

Steven.. The 345R installation in my 2007 XL with TAS600 and GDL69 works very well other than the little glitch that requires a breaker reset every once in a while. This is what the software update from Garmin will fix which I still have not seen. If you have XM weather, the fact that the ADS-B weather is not displayed on the G1000 is irrelevant. The XM weather is a better product. The TAS600 and the 345R are wired together and work together to provide the best result for traffic location. There is logic built in that compares accuracy of position, as I understand it, and displays the most accurate picture.

The traffic picture on the screen is significantly enhanced with the 345R and in my opinion is an excellent upgrade. Of course, now that Diamond owns the G1000 STC for the pre-waas systems, perhaps we'll see some new software that further enhances an already excellent system.

BTW... there are no wires, bluetooth, foreflight, etc. required for use with the 345R. I'm told you can send traffic from the 345R to foreflight on an IPAD using Bluetooth, but haven't tried it yet.

Happy New Year!

Barry Starkman, Commercial Pilot
N984ES 40.827
KEIK

[CFIDave]

I know there is a debate over which is better, TAS600 vs ADSB traffic, but I'd like to ignore that for now.

Having flown a lot of different DA40s with/without WAAS, with/without ADS-B traffic, with/without Avidyne TAS 600 active traffic:

- ADS-B traffic from a GTX345R blows away the TAS 600 active traffic. Not only is traffic indication much more accurate with ADS-B , but you also see traffic movement direction with ADS-B. If you have both units installed, ADS-B targets will be shown more than 95% of the time, even with 2 years to go before most aircraft in the US will have to equip with ADS-B Out. TAS 600 active traffic will continue to be important only outside the US where aircraft only need be equipped with transponders (no ADS-B Out) and there are no ADS-B ground station repeaters.

- SXM satellite weather from a GDL69A is somewhat superior to ADS-B weather from the GTX345R. With SXM, NEXRAD precipitation displays are more detailed (less blocky), additional weather products are available, and SXM always works on the ground. Whether these differences are enough to make you want to pay a monthly fee for SXM is of course up to the owner; many pilots will decide free ADS-B weather is "good enough."

For new aircraft flying in the US that now come standard with the GTX345R, I often recommend owners save money and not install TAS or GDL69A any more.

[Steven]

Barry, Thanks for the extra info. I see you had your installation done in Denver. I'm in Boston so that's a bit inconvenient. But, I would consider making the trip as I imagine this installation is a royal pain, and I'd really like to have it done somewhere that has done it before.

Dave, thanks for your info too. I consider traffic and weather info to be among the most important safety enhancements available to pilots, probably since the invention of GPS. So I really want to have the best of both, with redundancy if possible. I'd happily pay for TAS600 + ADSB traffic and XM + ADSB weather, if possible. As far as I know, weather, traffic, and my own stupidity are the three most likely things to kill myself and my family in the airplane. If technology can address the first two, then let's do it.

[Rich]

It won't be a problem for those who are not based or flying in or out of towered airports but for the rest of us it's an issue.

Even operating from many towered airports are not inherently a problem, either. For example there is only one airport in all of Oregon (Portland International) that would require ADS-B (and already a Mode C/S transponder). All other towered airports are merely Class D airspace, which has no such requirement.

Where I'm now based I could choose to fly almost anywhere in the State without having either. In fact, many folks have been doing this for years. You won't be seeing these planes on TCAS or ADS-B receivers.

Did you also know that neither is inherently required to fly IFR, if MEAs and clearances allow flying below 10,000 ft? ATC may make your life miserable doing so, though.

[waynemcc999]

Question to owners with GTX345R installed:

I've had the GTX345R installed in my 2008 DA40 XLS (G1000 WAAS). Regarding the ADS-B FIS-B products:

-- all METARs, Precip, TAFs, TFRs, Airmets/Sigmets, NOTAMs, Winds, etc get broadcast just fine via Bluetooth to my iPad/ForeFlight

-- only METARs and Precip get sent to the G1000 MFD.

My avionics shop and Garmin indicate that because my G1000 only understands the GDL90-interface-protocol (and not the newer GTX345 protocol), not all the FIS-B products are accepted by the G1000 MFD.

Fellow GTX345R/G1000 owners: what FIS-B products are you seeing displayed on your G1000??

Thanks,
Wayne

[Kyle]

Wayne,
I have a 2008 WAAS and my experience is the same as yours. I only see nexrad, METARs, and TAFs on the G1000.

[mdieter]

Just flew my first flight after the ADS-B upgrade. Wow there's a lot of planes in the air!

Good install experience with Calspan Research. 2041 Niagara Falls Blvd, Niagara Falls, NY (716) 236-1000. I'd recommend them.

We have a 2009 XLS with WAAS G1000, XM and TAS. They needed to replace the GTX33 transponder with a GTX345R (with optional GPS) and replace the GA55 XM antenna with combination XM and GPS antenna (inside the tail, no outside modifications). The TAS600 traffic information is now routed thru the GTX345 and combined. They also debugged a glideslope receiver issue and installed a USB power supply in addition to the ADS-B upgrade.

The cost breaks down as 39 hours of labor (not sure how much was glideslope and USB related), $600 for the new antenna, $400 for the USB power, and $5430 for the GTX345R. Total cost $10,440 USD. I plan to put the old transponder and XM antenna on eBay and hope to recoup some $$$.

We now have XM or FIS-B weather and TIS-B and TAS traffic on the MFD. Only one flight in, but so far so good.