What Oil Do You Run?

Discussions specific to Lycoming engines

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perossichi
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by perossichi »

Aero shell W100 plus cam guard. Hot weather here in Southern CA.
Sold 2002. Powerflo, Hartzell composite two blade, 530W/430, 345 transponder.
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Roxi5m9 »

My two cents: after buying my first plane 18 months ago, I went to Oshkosh last summer on a crusade to answer this question of which oil and which brand; AS or Phillips. I live in a mixed weather climate, I use the multi grade weight. I fly the plane weekly no matter what.

At the air show, I spoke in person to: Lycoming engineers who said, multi grade works for my situation, doesn’t matter which brand. Don’t need cam guard considering how much I fly.

I spoke to Diamond who said....it doesn’t matter.

I spoke to Blackstone at length whom I had do analysis on several oil samples....they say, it doesn’t matter....but Phillips is a little easier to oil analyze on because AS has a lot of stuff it in that can skew a particular reading.

I spoke to Phillips who said their product was better at cleaning, blah blah blah, and I don’t need camguard based on how much I fly.

I spoke to Aeroshell who said.....their product was better as a cold weather lubricant, blah blah, who starts their motor at -40 C unpreheated anyway...and they said DO NOT put camguard in their multigrade oil. It’s already it in their in another form.

The list goes on, the answer is it always never matters.

My final conclusion....no one knows/no one wants to own up to saying what’s best for a brand, and does it really matter, it’s oil and what’s important is you get out and fly the damn thing regularly and proper... proper heating, leaning, cooling. But then does that even matter, when flight schools never lean/beat the hell out of/shock cool the beans out of engines every day and they hold up great.

In the end I went with Phillips, because its straight oil, and I seem to like that versus a hybrid natural/synthetic/packed with a ton of other crap oil. No offense Aeroshell. I also picked it because my favorite color is blue, and I think the empty Phillips bottles look cooler on my hanger wall. There you have it.
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Rich
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Rich »

Based on my personal experience owning a DA40 for 17 years that has gone through periods almost every year where it sits for a month (sometimes more) unused:

- Aeroshell 15W50 produced no problems whatsoever for something like 10 years.
- Use of Philips XC 20W50 without additives for about 3 years after this - in 2015 wound up tearing down the engine for cam and cam followers producing metal. Cost about $16,000.
- Use of Philips XC in the last 4 years with Camguard. Just had its fourh annual since the engine rework. Filter examination showed no problems. Oil analysis not yet returned. I use about 1 qt. per 13 hours TT. Compressions of all cylinders: 78/80.

Other first-hand observations:
- The 20W50 is thicker when it's cold than is the AS 15W50. Seems logical, but its more than you would think. At 50-60 degree indicated oil temperature a 2000 RPM runup with 20W50 will peg the oil pressure. I never noticed this with the AS. I now don't do a real runup until it shows 80 deg or better.
- Putting additives in the AS will get you a distorted oil analysis. Many shops do not know this.
- The cost differential between the AS and Philips is negligible when figuring in the cost of Camguard for the latter.

My conclusions:
- The AS 15W50 with no additives other than what's included in the oil will work fine. I think they put the required additive on other variants of their oils.
- If you use Philips XC and your plane is subject to sitting around do not fail to use Camguard. The Lycoming cam being mounted at the top of the engine where it slowly loses lubrication when it sits and is slow to get fresh oil during starts needs something that will guard against those dry starts.
2002 DA40-180: MT, PowerFlow, 530W/430W, KAP140, ext. baggage, 1090 ES out, 2646 MTOW, 40gal., Surefly, Flightstream 210, Orion 600 LED, XeVision, Aspen E5
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Roxi5m9 »

Rich wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2019 8:27 pm Based on my personal experience owning a DA40 for 17 years that has gone through periods almost every year where it sits for a month (sometimes more) unused:

- Aeroshell 15W50 produced no problems whatsoever for something like 10 years.
- Use of Philips XC 20W50 without additives for about 3 years after this - in 2015 wound up tearing down the engine for cam and cam followers producing metal. Cost about $16,000.
- Use of Philips XC in the last 4 years with Camguard. Just had its fourh annual since the engine rework. Filter examination showed no problems. Oil analysis not yet returned. I use about 1 qt. per 13 hours TT. Compressions of all cylinders: 78/80.

Other first-hand observations:
- The 20W50 is thicker when it's cold than is the AS 15W50. Seems logical, but its more than you would think. At 50-60 degree indicated oil temperature a 2000 RPM runup with 20W50 will peg the oil pressure. I never noticed this with the AS. I now don't do a real runup until it shows 80 deg or better.
- Putting additives in the AS will get you a distorted oil analysis. Many shops do not know this.
- The cost differential between the AS and Philips is negligible when figuring in the cost of Camguard for the latter.

My conclusions:
- The AS 15W50 with no additives other than what's included in the oil will work fine. I think they put the required additive on other variants of their oils.
- If you use Philips XC and your plane is subject to sitting around do not fail to use Camguard. The Lycoming cam being mounted at the top of the engine where it slowly loses lubrication when it sits and is slow to get fresh oil during starts needs something that will guard against those dry starts.

After your success with Aeroshell and then problems with Phillips, is there a reason why you stuck with Phillips, Rich? If you mentioned it earlier in the post, I apologize.
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Rich »

Roxi5m9 wrote: Wed Jul 31, 2019 8:19 pm
After your success with Aeroshell and then problems with Phillips, is there a reason why you stuck with Phillips, Rich? If you mentioned it earlier in the post, I apologize.
Good question. Basically I figured I'd give Camguard a try and it's not compatible with the AS 15W50. I don't really know it was the switch in oils as during this period the plane was getting used less frequently than in the past and it was parked outside in a damp environment (KPAE). Since I can easily pay for a new engine at any time should the problem recur I'm not particularly concerned. So far, so good. It's still getting occasional downtimes, but it's a drier climate here and the plane is hangared.
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Steve »

My datapoint:

I've used Exxon Elite 20W50 since the airplane was new (18 years). I change the oil and filter every 25 hours, mainly because my annual usage has averaged only about 50 hours a year, and I do have periods of 3-4 weeks of inactivity every once in a while. I do operate in a hot, relatively dry climate (S. TX). Because of my recent issues:

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6905&start=10

...I got to inspect my engine innards at about 750 hours. Very little wear was noted, The cam and tappets were nearly pristine, with minimal wear, and no corrosion anywhere. I intend to continue using the Exxon (at least as long as my stockpile holds out - I have about 2.5 cases left). After that I'll probably switch to Aeroshell. My next-door neighbor is the Aviation products manager for Shell Oil, so I should be able to get some free samples...

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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Ultrapilot1 »

Phillips X/C 20-50 with Camguard
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Gearle »

Downeast25 wrote: Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:50 am I am approaching an oil change and wonder if anyone has done the research if it truly makes a difference what oil you run in your 40. I find most people where I fly go with the Phillips X/C 20/50. That is the most readily available. There are two other product however I can buy, one is the Aeroshell and the other Exxon Elite.
Coming back to this again my annual was just completed 8/5/2019. i had been using Aeroshell 100w to stop the burning of oil and fouling of my plugs (especially back left pilot side cyclinder). Mechanic has turned me on to Aeroshell 100W Plus that has antiwear additives.

so that's what i'm using now.
Plus Camguard.

Results? i just had the year old oil analyzed by Horizon Oil and there is NOTHING in the oil. it is PERFECT.
this is again a 2003 DA40 IO-360 M1A with 1500 hours on it.
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Roxi5m9 »

My co-owner and I fly the plane at least weekly, and total about 250 hours a year between the two of us. We run Phillips XC without any camguard because we feel we fly a lot. What are your thoughts on this? Should we be using camguard anyway?
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Re: What Oil Do You Run?

Post by Charles K »

Aero shell 15 50 with no additiona additives.
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