DA62 Anti Icing Performance

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rdrobson
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by rdrobson » Mon Nov 26, 2018 3:02 pm

klang wrote:Thanks Chris,
you are right; it is optical illusion. I downloaded and magnified the pic and, yes, clean leading edge.
Yes, that's right, the leading edges of the tail and wing were both very clean. While I had flown in icing several times before, this was the first time I had landed with a significant accumulation on the non-protected parts allowing me to get a good look at everything to make sure it was working properly.

I have learned that the longer it's been since the TKS system was last run, the longer it takes to prime the panels and it is very important to get the wings wet before getting in ice. The 'de-icing' capability of TKS is rather limited. For this particular flight, it had been about 2 months since the TKS was last run and since I knew I would hit ice immediately after departure, I made sure that I could see fluid on the entire leading edge before takeoff. I probably ran it on normal for a couple of minutes and then kicked it up to high for another minute or so before departure and then back to normal for takeoff.

Another thing I've learned, it's not unusual to get a 'DEICE PRESSURE LO' annunciation when starting the system for the first time in a flight. Usually, moving the switch to high for a minute or two clears that. I was told that warm TKS isn't viscous enough and can trigger the warning light. I keep my plane in a heated hanger and that probably contributes to the warning.

-Ron
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klang
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by klang » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:18 pm

Ron
reading about your experience is very interesting for me as I experience the opposite with TKS on my DA42 and that triggered my (wrong) suspicion about ice on your 62 tail.
It takes at least 15 min running the system on my aircraft until the wing outer panels get wet. Therefore, I got used to activating the system long before I suspect entering icing conditions (resulting in annoyingly high fluid consumption). During that period the HIGH pressure alarm comes on. Never have I experienced a LOW pressure alarm. Had maintenance check and purge the system with little or now improvement.
If too late (which, with my 42, means less than at least 10-15 minutes priming) ice builds on about 1.5 meters of the outer panels. Beyond annoying, it is not particularly safe and knocks off 10-20 knots airspeed.
The problem does not show on the elevator but only outer wing sections.
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by ememic99 » Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:09 am

klang wrote:It takes at least 15 min running the system on my aircraft until the wing outer panels get wet.
If you want to prime system immediately, you have to hit MAX button and then when wings are wet (which should be in 2-3 min) switch to High or Norm depending on actual accumulation.
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by jb642DA » Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:07 am

Check the FIKI supplement to the AFM Section 4, Normal Operating Procedures-

(this is from the DA62 supplement)

4A.6.1 PRE-FLIGHT INSPECTION
I. Cabin Check
Ice Protection System:
a) ELECT.MASTER ..................... ON
b) DE-ICEFLUID........................ check quantity
c) Doors .............................. closed

WARNING
De-icing fluids are harmful. For proper handling refer to the Material Safety Data Sheets which are available from the supplier of the de-icing fluid.

d) WINDSHIELD ........................ press push button
e) Spraybar ............................ evidence of de-icingfluid

NOTE
If the system has been inoperative for a while, has been drained or has run dry, trapped air - suspected in the feeder lines to the main pumps - can be removed from the feeder lines to the main pumps by activating the windshield pumps several times.

There are also some additional steps in the pre-flight part of the checklist also
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by jb642DA » Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:17 pm

I should have put this in previous post -

"Someone", when I bought our 42TDi, told me to exercise the TKS system every 30 days or so to "keep it wet". I record the latest TKS "use date" in a notebook in the plane.

If the system hasn't been needed by the end of 30 days or so, I'll run the system, while flying, until I see the fluid coming out along the entire leading edge of wing (usually about 3-5 minutes) and then shut it off. Probably uses about 1/2 gallon of fluid to do this. Following the flight, I look at tail surfaces for evidence of TKS fluid too. Maybe I'm "wasting fluid" doing this??!!

Colin, CFIDave or anyone else have any "techniques" to exercising the system and keeping it "wet"?
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by rdrobson » Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:43 pm

jb642DA wrote:Colin, CFIDave or anyone else have any "techniques" to exercising the system and keeping it "wet"?
The monthly use is mentioned in section 8.6.6 of the FIKI supplement to the AFM. One of the Diamond factory pilots recommended running the TKS in the summer only when you saw rain ahead. The reason being is that the rain washes away the excess fluid. Otherwise, you can get a lot of dust and dirt sticking to the aircraft surfaces and in general, it just makes a mess of things.

FWIW, my flight instructor out of Chicago said that they never bother with the 30 day run of their DA42's TKS system and haven't observed any ill effects.

--Ron
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by jb642DA » Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:41 pm

Thanks Ron
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by TomC » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:31 am

I recently started getting a 'DEICE PRESSURE LO' annunciation all the time, even when the TKS system is switched off. The only way to get it to go away is to pull the breaker. Anyone have any ideas what may be causing this?
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by jbrauertn » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:16 pm

Thanks for the posts on this subject everyone. I have a new DA62 (45 days old), and collected about the same amount ice as seen in the pictures. The TKS protected areas remained predominantly free of ice. We did experience a slight airframe buffet, so were careful to maintain speed and limit control inputs on approach. While the buffet certainly go our attention, the flare and landing was completely normal leading us to believe it was simply "turbulence" resulting from the ice in unprotected areas, but nothing affecting critical flight surfaces. Did anyone else observe such a buffet when encountering ice?


It also takes 3 -5 minutes before fluid begins to coat the surfaces and we can experience the Lo Pressure notice at times, but haven't noticed a decrease in functionality. Finally, the last outboard 12" of the right wing did not appear to get much protection so we contacted Diamond. They said that it was likely due to the TKS holes being filled with a foreign substance, likely wax. The dealer concurred and said that they waxed the aircraft prior to delivery and may have gotten wax onto the TKS panel. We have since cleaned the TKS panels with rubbing alcohol and then operated the system in flight and fluid flow appeared normal over the entire wing surface.


Sorry for the quality of the pictures . . .
Attachments
Ice 2.JPG
Ice 1.JPG
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Re: DA62 Anti Icing Performance

Post by rdrobson » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:59 pm

jbrauertn wrote:We did experience a slight airframe buffet, so were careful to maintain speed and limit control inputs on approach. While the buffet certainly go our attention, the flare and landing was completely normal leading us to believe it was simply "turbulence" resulting from the ice in unprotected areas, but nothing affecting critical flight surfaces. Did anyone else observe such a buffet when encountering ice?
Thanks for sharing your experiences!

Regarding buffet, I've experienced more of a vibration at times and I'm not sure what's causing it. It came on last night in very heavy snow but dissipated as the airplane slowed down. We really weren't accumulating anything as it was almost 0C. I've felt the same vibration in rain.

I did get a buffet once when I didn't get the TKS on soon enough and I let the aircraft get below 90 KIAS. The airplane still felt solid but I appreciated the warning.

--Ron
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