DA40NG

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TimS
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Re: DA40NG

Post by TimS »

Tommy wrote:Compared to the IO 360, the NG is a dog. However, if fuel consumption is paramount and you can give up a lot of useful load, the NG is your bird.
I believe the NG also has a slower turning prop. How does engine noise and vibration compare? What about prop noise and wind noise (usually more dominant then the engine) compare?
I think pilots often give short shrift to these concepts which can play a huge role in passenger comfort.

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Rich
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Re: DA40NG

Post by Rich »

You can always choose to run the IO360 at similar, lower RPM. I do this when just schlepping around, sightseeing.

I have ridden in a DA42 (back in the early Thielert days) and it was delightfully quiet in the cabin. I don't know how much was due to the engine/prop and how much was because the engine is not right out in front. But given there were two of them running ...
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Re: DA40NG

Post by TimS »

Rich wrote:You can always choose to run the IO360 at similar, lower RPM. I do this when just schlepping around, sightseeing.

I have ridden in a DA42 (back in the early Thielert days) and it was delightfully quiet in the cabin. I don't know how much was due to the engine/prop and how much was because the engine is not right out in front. But given there were two of them running ...
You pull the prop back that much on a IO-360 and you likely are pulling the power back a lot also. So if you want a high speed cruise, the NG "should" be quieter.

Good to hear on the DA-42. Hoping for a demo/test flight in one later this year.

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Re: DA40NG

Post by Antoine »

I have owned two DA40-180 with the Powerflow. These are wonderfully balanced aircraft with great performance and fuel efficiency and to me, balance is everything. It means fun, safety and graceful flying.
Put them side by side and it becomes obvious that he NG is an ugly, overweight, nose-heavy aircraft that loses a lot of the diesel cycle's efficiency to engine cowling aerodynamics. It looks wrong...
While it is absolutely true that Mr Dries had damned the -180, he is now gone and from the statements that have been published and re-posted here I fully expect that this amazing aircraft will get a new lease of life.
This said, it may well be that the best DA40 is the CD-155 diesel. This one also needs some minor development (avionics and MTOW) but the engine seems to have become a great product. Never flown in one though.
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Re: DA40NG

Post by CFIDave »

Tommy wrote:Compared to the IO 360, the NG is a dog.
If so, then how were we cruising along at 150+ knots TAS yesterday on a 2 hour x-country flight in a new DA40 NG? If the plane is such a dog, with full fuel and 2 adults onboard yesterday, how were we able to maintain a 900 fpm climb all the way up to 10,000 feet?

I'm tired of reading disparaging comments about the DA40 NG from people who may not have flown one.

IMHO, the NG is a far more comfortable plane to fly than a Lycoming DA40 -- it's actually just as quiet in flight as my DA62 twin (which I flew back-to-back with the DA40 NG yesterday). The feeling you get from flying a DA40 NG reminds me mostly of flying DA42s (just as quiet and smooth, the same size cockpit, reclining seats, same single-lever power control, etc.). And unlike on Diamond twins, the heater on the NG actually works as well as the one in your car.

Last week I flew a Lycoming DA40 XLS and Austro DA40 NG back-to-back on the same day. The Lycoming feels and sounds so "truck-like" and unrefined, compared to the Austro. When you combine that with the ease of starting the engine (just turn the key even when hot), no more mixture and prop controls, no need to manage and keep your cylinder temps in check, no need for pre-heat, no cowl shake when you shut down the engine, no concern about fouling spark plugs while taxiing, etc., flying the NG is just a much more pleasurable and refined experience. With less engine noise, vibration, and harshness, you're far less fatigued after a x-country flight in a DA40 NG.

My customer who bought this particular new DA40 NG actually traded in his 2008 DA40 XLS to get it, and is very happy with his decision. Initially I wasn't entirely sure it was the right move, but now that I've got about 15 hours flying his DA40 NG (x-country and instructing multiple pilots flying around the pattern), I have to agree that it's a major step up. Around Christmas, my customer flew his new DA40 NG all the way from Boulder, CO to the Washington, DC area with 4 people onboard in 8 hours of flight time with only 1 fuel stop. Try that in your Lycoming DA40.

As a former Lycoming DA40 XLS owner (for 4 years), I'd much rather fly and own a DA40 NG.
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Re: DA40NG

Post by pietromarx »

Dave -

Perhaps you know the answer to this: what was done on the NG to get the higher take-off and landing weights vs. the IO-360 version?

The DAI website lists the following:
Max Take-off Weight 2,888 lbs
Max Zero Fuel Weight 2,789 lbs
Max Landing Weight 2,822 lbs

Were there structural changes made to the MLG, NLG, and fuselage to support these new weights?

Thanks
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Re: DA40NG

Post by CFIDave »

pietromarx wrote:Were there structural changes made to the MLG, NLG, and fuselage to support these new weights?
I believe there was some additional structure added to the wing stubs near the fuselage where the main gear attach.
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Re: DA40NG

Post by Colin »

(I don't know the answer, but it means that if you took off max weight you'd have to fly around two hours before you could land.)
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Re: DA40NG

Post by pietromarx »

You're right - there is a single additional rib element for the MLG. I looked at the AMMs for both the DA-40-180 and the NG and it looks like small changes, including, but probably not exclusively the following:

1. they widened the stance of the MLG about 0.2 feet
2. Put in M12 bolts (vs. M10) for the MLG attachment.
3. added another elastomer to the NLG.
4. run the tire pressures 10 PSI lower on the NLG.

Too bad these aren't available for the -180.
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Re: DA40NG

Post by H60 pilot »

CFIDave wrote:
Tommy wrote:Compared to the IO 360, the NG is a dog.
. . . flew his new DA40 NG all the way from Boulder, CO to the Washington, DC area with 4 people onboard in 8 hours of flight time with only 1 fuel stop. Try that in your Lycoming DA40.
Not to put too fine a point on it, but yeah, I think I could.

Consider that I see book values in the 40s I fly now; 137 ktas @ 6,000 ft on 9.3 gph at or near gross weight. That's three of my family members plus day bags, or four with nothing but the clothes on our backs.

Now I don't know exactly where this destination is in DC, but I'll choose KHWY. That's 1,280 nm as the crow flies and 8+17 ETE @ 137 ktas with current winds at FL060. Doable with IFR reserves and a single fuel stop. I know it's not exactly an apples to apples comparison, but if I was challenged to fly this for real I'm confident I could do better still. And again this is my experience flying non-Power Flow equipped airplanes.

I want to love the NG, I really do. The creature comfort of flying with an Austro is alluring; automotive like start, push button run-up, intuitive power control, turbocharged, smooth and quiet, and jet fuel are all features I admire. Unfortunately in my eyes these virtues aren't enough to augment the NG's unattractive performance on paper. I will hold my final thoughts and purchase decision until I've flown an NG personally.
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